Gary Miles, Lawyer Coaching, Dina Cataldo, Be a Better Lawyer Podcast

#229: Going After Your Goals with Gary Miles

Meet Gary Miles.

He’s a family lawyer, a success coach, and a wellness advocate.

On this episode, we talk:

  • Gary's multiple lives as a lawyer and his transitions
  • the consequence of not going after our dreams, and
  • how to go after what you want without burning out

Listen in to get inspired to take action on your own life.


Are you a Be a Better Lawyer Podcast ride-or-die?

  • Be sure to follow on Spotify and Amazon Music or subscribe on Apple Podcasts and Stitcher. You can also subscribe to the video version of the podcast on YouTube.
  • Share it with your friends via text or on social media.
  • Leave a review.

Thanks for listening, and I'll talk to you next week.

Be a Better Lawyer, Apple Podcasts, Dina Cataldo
spotify, be a better lawyer podcast, Dina Cataldo

Dina (00:00):
Today I want to introduce you to my new friend Gary Miles. He is a practicing lawyer and also a coach for lawyers who feel stuck or unfulfilled. Gary is also a big advocate for lawyer wellness, and you all know we need more of those in this world. In this episode, we talk about Gary's multiple lives as a lawyer.

Dina (00:52):
We touch on substance abuse and how to recognize signs of a deeper underlying issue with those around us. The consequence of not going after your dreams and how the stories we tell ourselves either hold ourselves back or serve us. One topic we touch on in this episode is also time management and how we think about our time. And if you're struggling to manage your time or feel overwhelmed, I want to encourage you to download The Busy Lawyers' Guide. I've created a step by step process that will walk you through the mindset and the action steps you can take to begin making your life easier. One lawyer who downloaded the Busy Lawyers' Guide told me she had tried a ton of different things and this was the only tool that ever worked for her. If you notice yourself feeling anxious, a new planner is not gonna help you. Managing your time has nothing to do with the kind of planner you use. It has to do with how you strategize when you use any calendar system you're using. I walk you through the strategy and the reasoning behind it, inside the Busy Lawyer Guide. You can download it at

Dina (02:04):
That's All right, let's talk to Gary.

Dina (02:12):
Hello, Gary. How are you doing today?

Gary (02:15):
I'm doing just awesome. Thank you so much for having me on, Dina.

Dina (02:18):
It's my pleasure. I'm really glad that we're gonna have this conversation because I think more lawyers need to hear about other lawyers journeys and how we've been able to change things for ourselves. And you and I have chatted before and we've talked about some of the transitions that both of us have faced in our careers and our lives. And I really wanted to share with the people listening that you can make changes in your life, that you can face things that might seem really hard in whatever transition that you're making, and you can always overcome it and live a more fulfilling, more successful as who, however we wanna define it life.

Gary (03:06):
That's true, that's true. I, I often talk about the importance of being uncomfortable. You know, when when I started practicing law, I just wanted to have a life of comfort. I wanted to have the bills paid. I wanna have a nice house. I want to be, I want to be comfortable. Don't we all want to be comfortable, but we're comfortable mostly in our life because we're doing the same thing we've always done. We've done a thousand times, we know how to do it. It's easy. It's nothing new. It doesn't require any new skills or talents, and we're very comfortable. But it's also a place that's boring, same old, same old, and not a place where we ever grow when we're comfortable. We're never growing and change is always uncomfortable, but good things for me always come out of change, change off I, I started playing pickleball during covid with my daughter and son-in-law when there's nothing else we could do with them. I was terrible. I was embarrassing. But now it's become an advocation that I love and I'm decent at, and I can play it and enjoy it. So often, even if we fail, it's something the first time we're learning, we're growing, we're developing new skills, and we may find the lane that for us, is truly fulfilling.

Dina (04:16):
Oh, that's a great point because a lot of times I'll talk to lawyers who tell me they don't know what they're interested in. They don't know what they want, and then they don't pursue anything because they tell themselves, they just don't know. Versus like just trying things and being willing to be bad at them, being willing to fall on your face and maybe look stupid <laugh> and be uncomfortable. But in the process, not only are you gaining the skills of whatever is happening in your life that you're trying, you're also learning something about yourself and learning what you might enjoy even more than you think.

Gary (04:55):
That is so true. So often we say no to something just out of our own fear or own insecurity or worry about what other people will think. Um, but the reality is, every new experience we have, we learn. We may learn we don't like that, you know, but we, we may learn we have a skill or an aptitude for something that we didn't know we had, something we enjoy more or differently than whatever we might be doing now.

Dina (05:20):
Yeah. You know what came to mind when you were saying that is when I was first, I had a business years ago and I started it. I had no idea what I was doing, and I knew I needed a website. And so I googled everything about websites, how to build one. I had like a little course that I looked at and I figured out how to build my website on my own. And it was really hard. And I remember there were like days I would spend on this website and just be like, What the heck is happening? I hate this <laugh>. This is so hard. But it was something that I am so glad I went through because I've learned those skills and I didn't know that a couple years later that I would be easily changing up my website for my coaching business, that I would be easily navigating the website to post my podcast and doing all these things. And when we're doing something that's hard and we wanna bang our head against the wall, we can't see the compound effects of the hard work that we're putting in that's gonna reap benefits and just, it could be a really short time.

Gary (06:22):
Yeah, that's true. All you, you were laying the groundwork for something you didn't know you'd be doing. Exactly. By developing that, by developing that skill and, and learning something new.

Dina (06:31):
Yeah. And you don't know until you just try things.

Gary (06:35):
Yeah. Right. Exactly. Right.

Dina (06:37):
Okay, so there is, there are a couple things that I really wanted to talk to you about. I know that you've had multiple lives as a lawyer. Can you share a little bit about, um, why you became a lawyer in the first place and take us through your journey? Sure.

Gary (06:52):
Um, the why I became a lawyer is pretty simple. I've always followed in my brother's footsteps. He's nine years my senior, uh, great guy. Um, I went to the same college he went to and I went to the same law school he went to. And I think I became a lawyer because he became a lawyer and it interested me. I saw what he was doing, the practice of law. Um, and, and I did very, very well in law school. I clerked for in federal court for a year. And with that resume I could have gone anywhere. I chose pretty much, um, either out of the sense of appreciation or loyalty or retain, returned to the same small firm where I'd worked in throughout law school and nice folks. It wasn't for me, it was, um, just commercial work, just advising. And I wanted to become a trial lawyer.

Gary (07:41):
I wanted to be in court. So my first transition was kind of leave that kind of a practice and go with a firm that was sort of a boutique litigation defense firm. And I did a lot of defense work, mostly for insurance companies, mostly representing truck drivers and tractor trailers, which are not a preferred party. Most people don't say, I just love trucks and truck drivers. So it wasn't really easy, but I was good at it and it was fun. I had nice, when your insurance company is a client, they're intelligent, they understand. So they're kind of easy to work with in that sense. But as time went on, I became somewhat, I wanted something more. Um, it's very much a game. Um, um, pretending they're hurt less than they are, pretending they're hurt more than they are. Each hiring our own experts who always say the same things.

Gary (08:35):
I want something as a little more real and where my connection with my client was deeper because I might often have never met my client before in that and would never meet him since a truck driver. I'd be hired to represent a truck driver. I wouldn't know him, never know him after. And I wanted to have a real experience. So in 2009, I completely reinvented myself as a family law attorney. Um, I was around that time going through my own divorce, which was as amicable as they get. Um, I had referred out all the other divorce work that I had previously when I was so busy doing insurance work, but I wanted to do this, uh, on my own. So the fellow who was my divorce attorney, very nice guy. Um, he, he's about 12 years my senior and still practicing full time. He's done family law exclusively since the mid fifties, I think, and or some long period of time.

Gary (09:31):
And he was my mentor. He answered all the questions I didn't know the answers to, um, gave me forms when my client would call with one of these weird questions out in his family law. He was there to answer it for me. And, um, I'm so appreciative of what David Silverberg did for me. Um, he didn't ask to be compensated, asked for anything in exchange. We've since have helped each other out in numerous ways, but our friendship grew from that. And now I love being a family law attorney. I love helping people. Um, and I've now transitioned to a different role. My wife, um, who second wife, we've been married for 12 years when we got married to and become a nurse. So she went to, got her bachelor's degree while we're married, became an RN since it's gotten two master's degrees, become a director of nursing.

Gary (10:22):
We've had a home in Pine Hurst, North Carolina, which is kind of a golf mecca. I played competitively in high school and college. I wanted to retire here but not yet. Ended up that she was checking out kind of jobs. Got a great job here in last June, left to come to my dream home in North Carolina while I'm still up there fighting with divorce lawyers in Baltimore. So I followed her down. I transitioned out of my law firm, which is now run by my son and still work with it. Um, go up to try a case in a couple weeks, um, handle our incoming cases, but generally don't work that much in my law firm. So what can I do? And I have a passion for health and wellness. I've been sober for quite a long time. I chair the lawyer assistance committee in my county in Maryland for over 20 years.

Gary (11:10):
We would try to find lawyers and judges who are struggling with, um, wellness issues, whether it's depression or anxiety or substance abuse, and help them, um, show them a better way and had some amazing stories that were so uplifting and fulfilling. Um, but I would say not enough. Uh, I wanted to find more lawyers who were not yet folks would come to our program when they're really on the radar. Someone, a judge, a partner, a spouse referred them to us. I, I'd like to find people before it gets to that problem where they have to be identified and help them to be as successful and fulfilled as they want. So now I've built a service somewhat like, like you do, where we help lawyers be as happy and fulfilled and successful as they want. And a big part of that to me is both mental health, wellness and, and physical wellness. Because if we're stressed and anxious and depressed, we're not gonna be good lawyers and we're not gonna be happy lawyers. And that's kind of the first step. That's not the result of, that's what we have to do first is handle our mental health so we can bring our best self into the office with our coworkers, our staff, with the other lawyers we deal with, and really be as good as we're capable of.

Dina (12:24):
Yeah. You know, as you were talking, I was thinking about, you know, in court we are around lots of lawyers and lawyers talk, judges talk and we hear a lot of little complaints in chambers in, you know, the courtroom about, Oh, this lawyer's late all the time, or This lawyer doesn't do his job, or this lawyer doesn't do X, y, Z. You know, so there's all these little things and I just wanna offer for anyone listening that those might be signs of a deeper underlying issue that hasn't been addressed. And so to have compassion for those lawyers when they, they come on your radar, and that's not something I was always good at. It was when I really got into coaching and realized like, oh, there are a lot of people who have underlying issues as a lawyer. They're going through burnout, they're going through substance abuse problems, they're going through time management issues, that divorce, you know, those kinds of things are happening in their lives. And that could be creating that, that <laugh>, what we see is like that surface layer of their late, they don't appear to be focused, They're not showing up the way we need them to.

Gary (13:45):
Yeah, you're you're exactly right. You're exactly right. And I think what I've learned is, um, you know, it's okay to ask for support. Um, whether it's me asking David Silverberg for support, I, I had lunch with David, I wanna become a family law. I want you to teach me what I know. Or, you know, in, in, if someone's struggling with substance abuse to not publicly but privately, reach out to someone and say, you know, I don't, I don't wanna be drinking or whatever as much as I am, you know, what can I do? How can you help? What resources do you have? Whatever it is, Um, there are people who are here to help and help us to be as successful as we can. And I, I like what you said about kind of not judging the lawyer that is spoken about. Um, I've learned the only person that I should be judging is myself. You know, how am I doing today versus how I did yesterday and last year? Um, you said many people have issues. I suspect we all have issues.

Gary (14:44):
And often my experience as the person who acts the worst to me, me is the person who has the biggest personal issues going on. Um, I've had a couple, I had one circumstance where I was chairing a big meeting at a club, hundreds of people. And this one person was extremely rude. I mean, he was unquestionably rude and inappropriate and nasty and unfair. And everybody behind me said, put him in his place, whatever. Um, I just listened to him and, and tried to kind of get past it. And then later found out that he had two terrible issues with two of his sons. One was having open heart surgery at age 10 and very dangerous and risky. The other was severely autistic. And it was no wonder that he, he came and presented himself that way. It wasn't because of me. It wasn't personal. It's cuz he had stuff going on. And a lot of us have have that stuff.

Dina (15:35):
Yeah. And, and in the moment it is so hard to have compassion. So if you're hearing this and you're like, Oh, I just, I can't, sometimes, you know, you're not alone and that's okay. You know, just do the best you can, but know that sometimes that is the underlying issue.

Gary (15:50):

Dina (15:51):
I noticed that with me myself. Like I can, I can say that I, under the biggest stressors of my life, I'm not always well behaved. Right. Like, if you're under the biggest stressors of your life, you're probably not gonna be well behaved either. There were a couple things I wanted to talk to you about there. One was your 2009 reinvention. Okay. When you really decided you wanted to, you felt this calling for more. And a lot of us feel that calling, but not all of us honor that calling. So how did you recognize you had that calling and then decide you were going to honor it?

Gary (16:35):
Well, part of it was inflicted on me instead of chosen, to be candid. I had done work mostly for two insurance companies and one was moving in a different direction. And if I had been smart, I would've seen that having, being pretty much a sole practitioner and having two primary clients was not a safe place to be.

Gary (16:57):
And, and so I, it made me realize I wanted more diversity and it, and I went to work with clients who I felt truly appreciated what I, what I did for them. And, um, you know, so I mean, I took a bit of a leap. I invested in a website when my revenues didn't warrant it and in a whole different area. Um, but I tell you, it really paid off. It really paid off. We built a nice practice in family law and some people say, How can you be a family law attorney? How do, how do you not let that drama get to you? Well, I I love helping and supporting people, but it's never my drama. I mean, I don't, I don't go to bed at night, worry about my clients. You know, one call me right before this call was something fairly urgent.

Gary (17:41):
I handled it, I was empathetic, I listened, but it wasn't my, you know, it wasn't my problem. So, um, and it's the same when I came here in, in North Carolina. What am I gonna do to, I chose to become a coach. I really, calling is a good word, but it's almost too strong. It was more like a subtle hint or an intuition that had to sit. I had to sit with it for a while and I had to kind of let it be until it really boiled up to the surface as like, Oh, that's what I'm supposed to be doing. You know, that's what I need to be doing. I wish it was, you know, a calling like, I wish I got an email. Like, this should be what you should be doing next. But often we just figure out from, you know, circumstances as they present themselves, you know,

Dina (18:27):
Which is so interesting because when I say calling, I think of it as like a yearning. Like you yearn for something more. Right? So I think in some ways the word calling, the way that our society uses it is like, Oh, somebody just tells you like, and you're just gonna suddenly know you're gonna wake up one morning and you're just gonna be like boom, light bulb moment. And that was not my experience either.

Gary (18:50):
Not, not mine either. I wasn't criticizing your choice wasn't criticized your choice of words. Oh, no,

Dina (18:55):
No, no.

Gary (18:55):
Just I didn't explain that. For me it was a little longer term. It wasn't the light bulb going off, it was more, you know, gradually my choice was being lightened up by the sun.

Dina (19:05):
Yeah. What, what I wanted to really explain for the listeners, not really for you but <laugh>, but it's just like the words that we use can really influence how we think things should happen, how we judge and expect things to happen. And in our society, we do use that word calling. So I think it's a really good idea to just explain what our definition of that is cuz they might be hearing something totally different. Cuz that's, I definitely do. Like, I, I experienced a yearning for something and having no clue what it was and needing to go through that trial and error to figure out what felt right. And like I was on this big journey to get connected, quote unquote with my intuition, right? I did the whole, I went to Bali, I did all of the things right. And what I came to realize after that was that there is just what you decide, right?

Dina (20:04):
It's what you decide feels right and you decide to go after it. There's no outbound hit that comes in, there's no, um, bolt of lightning. And that's what I was expecting. But really what it was is I just decide and then I go for it and then I make mistakes and then I re decide if I don't like it. And I think that's just important for the people we're talking to, to know, because they might have the impression that they should just know by now. Which is what I thought. I don't know. Did you think that way when you were going through life?

Gary (20:40):
No, no. I think it, it takes, it takes a while and, and um, often what i, I choose to do or I think I want to do doesn't work out. And I realize in hindsight it wasn't supposed to work out. There was a reason life was supposed to go in a different direction and I'm glad I was, you know, pushed along that way. But I, like you find that it's not a bolt of lightning kind of a thing. Often I think there's subtle messages that create a feeling inside me that oh, this is, this is what I want. And then the next step for, for me and I didn't know about you cuz you create a whole new field for yourself as well. You transformed yourself in, into a coach from, you know, prosecutor, trial lawyer. Um, it is getting over the fear of partly getting over what will people think and getting over what if it doesn't work. Um, and, and am I okay with putting myself out there? All those things that are own mental hurdles that we have to overcome to be successful. Cuz it's easy to give into those and say, well I don't have the time, I don't have the money of the interest. I have a good job. And that it's easy to use excuses to stop ourselves from doing what we really want to do, but are afraid to do.

Dina (21:55):
Yeah. And the excuses sounds so reasonable, especially the I don't have enough time or I'll do it later. Those are my favorites. Yeah. I mean those are the ones that I had too, you know, and, and then it's just, okay, how much do I wanna be in pain? Right? Cause like, is the more you're resisting that urge to do something different for me anyway, I'll speak for myself. The more pain I was in and the less connected to myself I felt.

Gary (22:27):
Right. Right. Well said. I agree.

Dina (22:31):
So how did you decide that you wanted to enter this lawyer wellness field in all its different permutations?

Gary (22:41):
Well, I just realized throughout my life I've had a, a passion to coach and mentor other people. Um, running my law firm for three decades. I had lawyers and staff who worked with me and I love mentoring them. Um, I've also been someone who, whatever I've done, I've always had a mentor or a coach. I think I mentioned to you, I, I played golf, I played golf competitively. Beginning in eighth grade. I've had a golf coach. I don't think I've ever not had a golf coach and I'm now 67. You think by now I would've learned how to play the game. But it really is always helpful to me to have a sounding board and someone who improves my confidence. Who, and and that's a sort of an analogy, but in whatever I do, I think it's helpful to be, to have a mentor and to be a mentor.

Gary (23:27):
And I find it very, very fulfilling to help other people accomplish their dreams, whatever they might be. And, um, I'm blessed that right now I don't really do this, um, for the income. That's not my primary why, but my primary why is I find it fulfilling to be of, of help and service to other people. So once it kind of dawned on me that that's what I wanted to do, then I had to get over a lot of hurdles. Like, I'm too old who's gonna talk to someone who's 67? Um, I'm a male who's coaches are females. I made all these stuff. I kept telling myself as a way to hold me back. And when I served my podcast, I spent so long getting ready to get ready, I just wouldn't pull the trigger, you know? So my biggest hurdles weren't the decision, but it was what came after the decision, trying to talk myself out of it or make excuses, you know?

Dina (24:19):
Yeah. And it's so interesting that you say that about like, uh, I'm a male and most coaches are female. That's really interesting to me because the most famous coaches in the world are male, right? So you've got Tony Robbins, Brendan Burchard, you've got all of these male coaches. I'm curious why your brain didn't go to them.

Gary (24:40):
Well, because I was trying to, my fear it was really fear. It wasn't magic. And, and if I said, Oh, I could be the next Tony Robbins, well that's, that's not fear based, you know? So it, it, it was, I'm not saying that everything I was saying was real or true, but I'm saying, I was saying that to myself has a way to justify my hesitancy to do something I really wanted to do. Yes. But is it worth, it was a story I was making out. What I find is we, we tell ourselves stories that either hold us back or serve us. And me telling myself most lawyer coaches or female is a way of holding myself back from doing something I wanted. And I don't need to say that. And, and instead of me saying I'm told to be a coach, um, I could say I have 43 years of experience and not many other coaches have that. So whatever, whatever negative thought we have, we can turn it into to a positive.

Dina (25:33):
Okay, let's put a pin in it here. Let's highlight this. If you're listening to this, I want you to play that back. Okay. Because what we just talked about are the stories that we tell ourself. And we can either tell ourselves stories that hurt us and hinder us or that help us like listen to that over again <laugh>. Cause the stories that we have, just like Gary said, they are not true. Like they are there. They are designed by our brain to keep us in fear so that we don't do anything differently. Okay? So if there's something that you're yearning to do, keep that in mind. Your brain is going to do everything in its power to attempt to derail you and stop you <laugh> from doing it.

Gary (26:20):
Yeah. Our, our brain does work that way. That's so, that is so true. And you know, so often when we think about the future, um, you know, I could tell with the podcast it's, I've, I've started about six months ago and, and I told myself, No wanna listen to it. Well, first off, no one knows I haven't started the darn thing yet. I don't know what the truth is. I don't if people wanna listen to it or not. So why tell myself no one wants to listen to it. Maybe I should tell myself people are gonna really like hearing what I have to say. We don't know if either one or true cause I haven't started it yet. But tell ourselves something that will help us be successful. Just to draw a stupid little analogy, I, I played competitive golf and if I'm playing you, and we're even on the 17th hole when I have a five foot putt to stay even and I think, Oh, if I miss this, I'm gonna be one hole down with one hole to play. I'm likely to miss it. I'm gonna be distracted, I'm gonna be thinking about the result. But if I think about, Oh, I can make this, I've done this a thousand times, I'm more likely to make it. Neither of those are jokes haven't the put yet. But what I think about really will affect how I feel and how I bring myself to whatever's before me.

Dina (27:30):
Yes. Ah, I love that so much. Okay. I want to honor your time and I wanna make sure that we let everybody know about a couple good things. One of them is your eight key tips to maintain boundaries and prevent burnout that I saw on your website. You wanna tell them more about that and how they can get their hands on that?

Gary (27:52):
Sure. If you go to my website and, and you like to get that, just type in your name and your email address, I'll send it to you right away. I think so many lawyers, but other professionals struggle with setting boundaries. We wanna be successful, we wanna do everything the boss asks. We wanna bring in as much business to the firm. And so we say yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. When sometimes maybe know is the right answer, you know, sometimes we need to communicate what we're capable of and be true to ourselves. And when we set those boundaries, we really can be, you know, more fulfilled in our, in our job and in in our home.

Dina (28:28):
Yeah. And for your podcast, I mentioned it at the beginning of this one, the free lawyer podcast, where can they find that and when do you have new episodes?

Gary (28:39):
Um, every, it's, it's on Apple, Spotify, Google, Um, it's published through so you can find on any of those sites, whether you're app or Android user or on your computer, the free Lawyer Mondays, I've published an individual episode where I talk about some mindset issue, whether it's overcoming fear, boundaries and burnout, uh, how to manage stress, whatever it might be. Last, this Monday was all about avoiding blame in the office. How do we handle that office crisis without blaming people? What's a better way to handle it on Thursdays? I have guest episodes and they come out every Thursday and, and I usually pick someone who has a service, which is helpful to lawyers. Um, and and that's what I do on Thursday. So love to have you all. Listen, if there's anything any of your listeners like to hear that haven't covered, they can message me on LinkedIn. I'm very president on LinkedIn. I'm happy to cover any topic that's of interest to folks. Um, this, this week my kind of, of my message on Linked In has all been about mindfulness and how to be mindful, which is something I struggle with. My brain goes all kind of places, but being mindful is really, really important to me.

Dina (29:52):
Mm. There were a couple more questions that I did wanna ask you. One is, what are the books that are on your nightstand right now?

Gary (30:00):
Hmm. Well the one book, one for fun that my daughter gave me is about, uh, Phil Nicholson and Tiger Woods. The new book about their competitiveness. Golf is my, uh, passion or addiction, one or the other. And the other is, I'm reading a book by Ron Baker, I'm forgetting the name of it, but it's all about how to bill clients on a value based system instead of an hourly based system. Because, you know, our, our, particularly in family law, people say, how much will this cost us anywhere between 5,000, 7,000? I don't know. That's not helpful to the client. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And, and it creates a situation of conflict where the more we work the file, the more we make and the more we harm them. So short of this inherent conflict in the hourly billing system, so a lot of, some lawyers are creating this new method where they bill for pieces on an agreed price beforehand. I'm really studying that cuz I think it's important to our profession to look at different ways of generating revenue that are more client friendly.

Dina (31:00):
Yeah. And it doesn't all have to be one thing. Like we tend to look at it very black and white, like, Oh, it should be hourly, it should be packaged. It's like, no, there's room there to play. Right.

Gary (31:11):
The one other you asked about my nightstand, The trouble is I read everything on Kindle. So maybe forget about having recently read Every Day Legacy. It's fantastic. Um, Cody is the author and, and it's all, he actually was in the funeral business and it, it, it was his, it came to him that the importance isn't what we leave people, but living our life today to create the memories that we want people to have to us and let that be kind of our guide. And for me it was very transformational, actually on a personal level, caused me to reach out to two family members, kind of apologize for how I had handled situations and reset them. Uh, because how I left that, if, if I went here now it's not how I wanna be remembered. That's not who I want to be. So I really like everyday legacy.

Dina (32:03):
I love hearing what other people are reading. Is there anything else you wanna leave our listeners with?

Gary (32:10):
No, just, um, enjoy, enjoy the moment. Um, the, the biggest thing I've learned in my life is to not live in the past. I'm sober and recovery. So when you get to that place or things we've done in our past that are unsavory, um, bad, um, that's a place of shame and guilt and remorse and regret and sometimes resentment over how we're treated. I try not to live in the future, which is always a place of worry and fear and enjoy the present. Just to be as present in the moment as as we can and enjoy every single moment cuz they're all gifts.

Dina (32:43):
I love that one

Gary (32:44):
Analogy. I just wanna throw this one analogy real quickly that is in this book is my math may not be right. I think it was if you told me I'll give you $84,400, would you take it? Sure. But you have to spend it today and if you don't spend it today, you have to give it back. So I would be very mindful and purposeful in how I spent that money to make the most of it. Well, that's how many seconds we have in the day and how many seconds do I waste that I'll never get back that when I don't use 'em. Right. They're gone scrolling social media, whatever it might be. So it made me realize how important it is to treasure and utilize every moment to the fullest.

Dina (33:23):
Mm. That's wonderful. All right my friend. Thank you so much. Well thank you

Gary (33:27):
Dina. Thank you very much for having me. Thanks for all you do for, for lawyers too.

Dina (33:32):
Thank you. Gary is so nice. I encourage you to connect with him on LinkedIn and I will link to everything that we talked about in the show no***@de*********.com slash two nine. Now, if you listened to today's episode and thought, hmm, this coaching thing sounds interesting, I want to invite you to a strategy session with me. Like we mentioned in this episode, with both of our experiences, it's really easy to put things off. Our brain literally wants to make doing anything new as difficult as possible. No more putting things off. No more letting your brain boss you around. Book a call with me. I promise you that you will not regret it. When lawyers come to strategy sessions with me, I make it my goal to help them get more value, more insight into their lives in one hour than they have gotten in years. Why?

Dina (34:33):
Because it's important that we start to challenge ourselves and the way that we think. And over the years I've learned to create a space where you get to feel comfortable sharing what's really going on in your life yet challenged. Because I will ask you questions that are going to challenge how you think that might make you uncomfortable. But the great thing is, is that because I've been doing this for so long, I will notice some things, some signals if you're uncomfortable and I am going to just gently come in and ask you questions. Okay? And we're gonna explore that cuz that's what I do as a coach with my clients, is I recognize when there's some discomfort and I start to ask them questions that will gently guide them in the direction where they're going to feel safe to make a decision about what it is that they want.

Dina (35:28):
And we talked about this in the last episode on nervous system dysregulation. And that's what I work with my clients on. So I know very well now how to find the topics that are going to help us discover where your work is and at the same time be really kind and gentle with you no matter what it is that you're coming to me with. So when we are challenged in that non-judgmental way, that's when we grow. So if you are ready to grow, if you've been listening to this podcast and you're like, Yes, this is for me. Book a call with me, go to This is not something that we can afford to wait on. And let me tell you why. Because when we put off our dreams, right, and that's what we were talking about in this episode today. When we put off our dreams, a little part of us dies.

Dina (36:26):
And if there is part of you that wants something more that is being called to something more that has this desire for something more and you keep shutting that voice down, eventually the voice will go away and you'll be left with regret. And I've always promised myself I didn't wanna live with regret. I wanted to just go after what it is that I wanted and if I can support other people in that process, great. So book a call with me, go to and I hope to talk to you there. All right, my friend, I hope you enjoyed this episode. This was a really fun one to record. I really hope that you do go and connect with Gary and I will talk to you soon.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *